Maxeme Tuchman is the CEO and Co-Founder of Caribu, an interactive video-calling platform that helps grandparents and parents, read and draw with children when they’re not in the same location. She has been the winner or finalist in 30 international and national pitch competitions and is the 59th woman to raise more than $1M in venture funding. Maxeme was most recently appointed by President Obama to serve as a White House Fellow at the U.S. Department of the Treasury where she served as a senior policy advisor and worked on issues of financial inclusion. Her commitment to educational equity began as a Teach For America corps member, teaching 480 high school students in inner-city Miami, and has led to working on educational innovation projects with organizations such as the Harlem Children’s Zone, DC Public Schools, and the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. She is a graduate of the Coro Fellowship in Public Affairs, and the Miami Fellows Leadership Program. Maxeme received her B.A. from New College of Florida, holds an M.B.A. from the Harvard Business School, and an M.P.P. from the Harvard Kennedy School of Government.
00;00;00;00 - 00;00;25;01
Narrator
At a crossroads of uncertainty and opportunity. How do you navigate forward? This podcast focuses on making smart choices in a rapidly changing world. We investigate the challenges of being at a crossroads and finding opportunities that arise out of disruption. Listen in on future forward conversations with the brightest luminaries, movers and shakers. Let's navigate forward together and create what's next.
00;00;25;03 - 00;00;46;00
Lisa Thee
Hi everyone, and welcome to the Navigating for Red Podcast. My name is Lisa Thee and I'll be your host today. One of my favorite hobbies in life is collecting experts and really interesting people. And at the top of my list is Miss Maxeme Tuchman, the founder of Caribou and the master of all the Things. And I'm so excited to be sharing her with you today.
00;00;46;05 - 00;01;08;05
Lisa Thee
Welcome to the show, Max. Thank you for having me. So, Max, for those of you that don't know about your amazing career journey, can you share a little bit about where you started and where you built up to from here?
00;01;08;07 - 00;01;32;10
Maxeme Tuchman
Well, my career, I actually look like I've been running from the FBI the amount of times I've changed jobs in cities. I see myself. I'm like an older millennial. So I, I quite like I just never really took to the idea that you should go to one company and spend 40 years there like that. Just didn't excite me. I'm kind of like the dog from up where I like squirrel and I like finding new shiny problems and I working on them and then being like, okay, next time you problem.
00;01;32;10 - 00;01;56;01
Maxeme Tuchman
And a lot of times the next big shiny problem is in another company. So, but I've also always been very focused on educational equity since I was like actually a little girl. And so my career has, has been in that space. So I've been jumping around and I always say it's like, you know, when I'm coaching high school or college students, I'm always talking about like pick industry or function.
00;01;56;04 - 00;02;16;24
Maxeme Tuchman
Right? So if you're if you're going to if you want to be a lawyer, great. That's your function. And then you can choose to be a lawyer in a bunch of different industries or pick an industry like I did with education. And then you can pick a bunch of really cool different functions with that industry. And so I chose education as my industry and I was a public school teacher.
00;02;16;29 - 00;02;48;29
Maxeme Tuchman
I ran Teach for America was executive director of Teach for America. For a while I worked at the Gates Foundation. I worked with Michelle Rhee at public schools. I worked for Mayor Bloomberg. I worked at the Treasury Department on education initiatives while I was a White House fellow for Obama. And then I ended up here running Caribou. But in each of those different spaces, I was trying to tackle a problem and like, either turn around an organization or turn around a project. And it's always been kind of in the the industry of educational equity.
00;02;49;02 - 00;03;12;20
Lisa Thee
I love that. Can you tell us a little bit about where you're from and maybe some themes of your childhood that inspired some of your passion to work in this space?
00;03;12;20 - 00;03;35;28
Maxeme Tuchman
Yeah, so I'm from Miami, not Florida. Miami. And my my background is actually like what has inspired most of my work. So I'm a Jew. Ben Which means Jewish, Cuban So both my parents are Cuban Jews. It's not like a Cuban married a Jew. It was just a lot of Cuban Jew on Cuban Jew. And so the whole family is, is, is, is has experienced. I have what's the word like discrimination, Right. Like, I mean, we have been persecuted in every African country we've lived in.
00;03;36;00 - 00;04;00;08
Maxeme Tuchman
And that's the Jewish story, Right? That's I mean, I always say as a Cuban Jew, it's a lot of food and a lot of guilt. And on my dad's side, my grandmother actually went through the Holocaust. She survived Auschwitz. His dad ended up being kind of in the underground railroad of the Holocaust. Right. Like living in attics and moving to people's basements and living in the woods and eating squirrels kind of thing.
00;04;00;10 - 00;04;20;28
Maxeme Tuchman
And they were after after the war ended, they were displaced persons camp for so long that my oldest uncle was actually born in Germany in a refugee camp. So, you know, did you have family going through that traumatic experience? They moved to Cuba and then on my mom's side, they ran out during the Bolshevik Revolution from Ukraine. Right.
00;04;20;28 - 00;05;01;03
Maxeme Tuchman
So like they had their own situation and they ended up in Cuba. And then, of course, Castro comes to Cuba and everyone's like, we've seen this before. And honestly, the only place where they knew that their next generation would not face as much persecution or hopefully not no persecution was the United States. And and I feel like when you grow up with that type of history, when when you have people in your life that have made such sacrifices for you to have the opportunity to to embody the American dream like feel a pressure and and it and it also it creates like this feeling that you can never repay them.
00;05;01;06 - 00;05;18;13
Maxeme Tuchman
Like, I just feel like like I've been a I've been in some cool places and I still feel like I haven't achieved enough to make it up to my like, I got to Harvard and I was like, I still feel like I have it like showing you that I'm so grateful to, you know, made sure that I was born here.
00;05;18;13 - 00;05;38;19
Maxeme Tuchman
Like, it's I think a lot of people can relate to that feeling of you're standing on the shoulders of your ancestors to get to where you are and you're living the dreams of multiple generations. And I also think that a lot of people that have immigrated to the United States reflect that pattern of education as the path to advancement.
00;05;38;21 - 00;05;57;29
Lisa Thee
And so I think that you're living a very true value to that. Can you tell us a little bit about Caribu, your app, and how it supports education?
00;05;57;29 - 00;06;29;19
Maxeme Tuchman
Absolutely. So when I was a teacher, I was a high school teacher, So most people think I was an elementary school teacher because I care so much about early childhood education. But the reason I care so much about early childhood education is because I was a teacher. So I had these 12th graders, right? I have 180 days to ensure that they are on track and that they can be productive citizens when they graduate from high school. And I was shocked and I knew that this was out there. But I just when you when you read your students papers and you realize that they're reading and writing on a fifth grade reading level and they're 18 years old, what do you feel like?
00;06;29;21 - 00;06;56;21
Maxeme Tuchman
How how are you going to, like, make up for that time in 180 days? And I realized I was like, okay, as much as I love teaching high school as much as I could, this is like the funnest things and like, anything, like it's too late, right? These kids need better advocates and better equity earlier in life. And so then I thought, you know, I looked at the charter we and I was like, oh, middle school.
00;06;56;21 - 00;07;10;00
Maxeme Tuchman
Like, that's why all the charter schools are starting in middle school, because it's like they call it the fourth quarter, right? They're like this because Miami Heat. Right. The Miami Heat is famous for like in the fourth quarter. All of a sudden, they win the whole game. Like, I didn't even show up to Miami Heat games for the fourth quarter because I was like, mad.
00;07;10;00 - 00;07;36;09
Maxeme Tuchman
Like, they're going to like mess around and then the fourth will win it. And so like middle school the fourth quarter and I was like, Nope, still too late. And then you start looking at elementary school and you're like, Whoa, still too late. And you start looking at the research and you realize, Oh my God, if we do not provide a high quality early childhood education between zero and pre-K like this is before anyone is even in schools is 0 to 3.
00;07;36;12 - 00;07;53;11
Maxeme Tuchman
If we don't allow kids to be read to for 20 minutes a day, not allow. But like if we don't give them access to high quality content so that they have, you know, that they're hearing 30,000 unique words that they're being read to for 20 minutes a day. Once they start reading, they should be reading for 20 minutes a day.
00;07;53;11 - 00;08;13;28
Maxeme Tuchman
Like you start looking at the research and realizing like, oh my gosh, like it's like building a house with a very bad foundation. If you build that foundation in a shoddy way, that house is not going to have a fighting chance. And I think I, as you heard from my career, I really tried to go the traditional route.
00;08;13;28 - 00;08;50;07
Maxeme Tuchman
I was like, oh, foundations, government, like, you know, nonprofit, like, I'm going to fix this. And all I found was adults fighting with adults about what's best for adults. And so I got to a point where I said, I need to build something that doesn't go through the bureaucracy, that doesn't go through the nepotism, that doesn't go through contracts and fees that literally is consumer focused, that goes straight to the parent, goes straight to the child, goes straight to the caregiver or guardian, and allows kids to have access to high quality content so that between the ages of zero and three, they're building a strong foundation.
00;08;50;07 - 00;09;13;29
Maxeme Tuchman
And that's where Karibu comes in. So Karibu, we bring families together in virtual playdates. You can draw, read, play games together in a video call, and it's all interactive, all real time, right? So a lot of people are like, Oh, that's face time. And I'm like, No, space time is a video calling service and for kids is the most boring thing on the planet.
00;09;14;01 - 00;09;30;18
Maxeme Tuchman
But when you get my kids to talk to their grandma and face time for more than 3 minutes and they love her. Yeah, but think about grandma for grandma, right? What does she what does she know about what's happening in their lives? She's like, I was school. Are you fighting with Jackie? So did you eat something? And then the kids like peace, right?
00;09;30;18 - 00;09;57;01
Maxeme Tuchman
Like, Yes, yes, yes. Or. Or you're responsible for sitting on the other side of the phone being like, focus, Grandma, answer the question. Right. Like that sentence. But what we found with therapy, So what Karibu does is allows you to have that video call so you can see the other person, Right? So you have a trusted adult that's reading with you, creating good habits, making you laugh, asking questions, and you can see the content so you can turn the pages together.
00;09;57;01 - 00;10;17;03
Maxeme Tuchman
You can see the writing. The illustrations call her together. You're having this. We actually call it a magical care because that is such a magical experience. We have grandparents that right in and go, I cannot get my kid, my grandkid off the phone like like the magical care we call last so long. I have to end it before I use to call back to be like, Let's keep talking.
00;10;17;03 - 00;10;37;15
Maxeme Tuchman
Like she's like, Now I have to end it. So I think I like what I love about what I get to do is that I get to put a high quality library in the pocket of a parent or grandparent or child so that they have access to incredible content so that they're building things. And I don't compete with like 82,000 homework, right?
00;10;37;15 - 00;11;11;20
Maxeme Tuchman
I'm not teaching kids to read. We're not in schools. We don't sell to schools. There's no way I would want to sell schools. We help kids learn to love to read, which is actually a huge and important thing that is part of learning to read. Well, I can't tell you I've been aware of your platform for a while, but frankly, I became a user when the pandemic hit and all of a sudden I became the mom and the teacher and the all the things the cleaning lady in addition to my day job.
00;11;11;20 - 00;11;30;07
Maxeme Tuchman
And it was a great way for me to be able to expand the opportunities for connection with my kids in a loving way, with their grandparents to fill some of those roles. So can you tell us a little bit about your glamor? I don't think most people know about glamor, and I would like them to learn more. Yes.
00;11;30;10 - 00;11;56;27
Maxeme Tuchman
So before the pandemic and even more so after the pandemic, really hit, and we here in the United States, our core customer is glamor. So she is a glamorous grandma. She is 50 to 70. She is the most disposable income in the country. She makes four times that her millennial daughter makes. She's super active. And most people don't believe me when I say this, but she is tech savvy and that's actually why we focus on 50 to 70, right?
00;11;57;00 - 00;12;21;29
Maxeme Tuchman
That's the age where, again, you grew up with computers at work. You are tech savvy, 10,000 people, they turn 65. Right. So this is a group that's growing and this is a group that really has this pain point because at 50 to 70, that's a lot of times your first grandchild and a lot of people are building a relationship with their grandchildren today, more and more so virtually.
00;12;22;06 - 00;12;41;12
Maxeme Tuchman
Right. There are a lot of grandparents that do get to live close. But even if you live 200 miles away, like in the next county over, you don't get to see the grandchild as often as you'd like to, and especially if you live states away or countries away. It's very difficult. And so before the pandemic, grandma had that the highest need.
00;12;41;12 - 00;12;59;13
Maxeme Tuchman
I mean, she just was like, oh my gosh, I haven't seen my grandchild. I want to do something really fun with them. I want to again, engage them and hold their attention. And then when the pandemic hit, obviously, I mean, grandma had a 12.5% hospitalization rate when she walked out the door, Right? I mean, she needed this more than ever.
00;12;59;13 - 00;13;18;23
Maxeme Tuchman
And then think about social isolation, right? Even before the pandemic, seniors were really fighting off social isolation. Now even more so. And they can't see grandkids. There's grandparents who haven't even met their grandkids yet because of the pandemic. I mean, all of these things where we keep hearing stories of grandparents that were depressed and then found Karibu and they're like, oh, my God, like lit up my life.
00;13;18;26 - 00;13;45;10
Maxeme Tuchman
We have a grandpa that talked to us about the fact that he loves the Karibu calls because he's getting to know each of the grandkids individually and what their interests are and and getting to spend individual time with them. We have a guy in India who tweeted about his parents not being able to meet their grandchild because I was bordering the pandemic and because we have a 0 to 3 category, they've been able to engage the child and play the baby.
00;13;45;10 - 00;14;18;29
Maxeme Tuchman
Right. Because so with babies, you want to invoke conversational turns? Well, conversational terms are is if the baby gurgles or smiles or or laughs. Right. Like that is them interacting with you in the content. And if you have high contrast pictures and pictures of babies. Right. There's something on the screen for that child to interact with and all the associations of American or the American Academy of Pediatrics and all the Harvard health experts, they love care when they say it's not there, it's not the screen time they're talking about.
00;14;18;29 - 00;14;37;06
Maxeme Tuchman
Right. What they're talking about when they say we don't want kids on screens, they don't want someone in front of a screen for 8 hours watching SpongeBob, that becomes you become a screen zombie. But when you have a child interacting in a video, call with educational content, that's great. That's a great use of screen time. And we've heard that from parents as well.
00;14;37;06 - 00;14;55;11
Maxeme Tuchman
This year is like, I feel like I'm actually a good parent putting my kid in front of care. Yeah, I must admit that it's a quality screen time that I was looking for as a parent, and in my personal circumstances, I have the luxury of having grandparents 10 minutes away. But after the lockdown, they might as well have been 10,000 miles away.
00;14;55;11 - 00;15;21;19
Maxeme Tuchman
We just couldn't interact the same way face to face. And for my elementary school age, children that are still practicing reading, Karibu was a godsend because they were able to be looking at the same thing at the same time. They were able to be part of solving the problem. But most importantly, I felt really good about helping to combat the loneliness for both my children and my parents because it was a way for them to connect and have meaningful engagements.
00;15;21;19 - 00;15;49;29
Lisa Thee
And I think we all know that loneliness was an epidemic before COVID hit, and it's just got accelerated from here. So can you talk a little bit about how Curb is helping to combat that loneliness epidemic?
00;15;50;03 - 00;16;16;07
Maxeme Tuchman
Yeah, I think the statistic is social isolation. So there's loneliness and there's the isolation and loneliness. There's there's two different ones. One is you literally are isolated there. You just do not see other people. And then loneliness is, I think, the one where you are surrounded by people. You might actually live in an independent living or facility and you just feel lonely. And I think we kind of saw both where the the the statistic is loneliness is is causing the same health issues as smoking 15 packs of cigarets a day.
00;16;16;10 - 00;16;58;12
Maxeme Tuchman
I mean it's it's wow that the health issues that come from loneliness are actually really severe and there's already been research done that shows that even once a week doing a video call with family can help stave off things like Alzheimer's and dementia and kind of the bigger health issues of loneliness. And I think one of the things that grandparents are like loving about care is, again, having that once a week video call with your grandchild, if they're not paying attention or if they're not engaged, is not creating that kind of brain activity that allows you to feel connected.
00;16;58;14 - 00;17;29;04
Maxeme Tuchman
So you kind of need something like caregiver that has an in-app library that has content integrated with it so that there are those we call them icebreakers, right? So there are those icebreakers, so you can get that conversation going so that you can create something where you're doing something together that starts another conversation. Or we actually had a grandmother and she's in Florida and her grandchild's in California and in I don't recall when it was, but there was an eagle that was that had laid an egg.
00;17;29;04 - 00;17;46;12
Maxeme Tuchman
And the egg was like, it's a bald eagle is almost extinct birds. And there was a camera on it and they were watching it together. But there's a book that we have called Rigby on Cable. So they would read the book and then talk about like they would pause and like talk about like, where did you see the cam today?
00;17;46;17 - 00;18;07;14
Maxeme Tuchman
You see the little crap like, oh, what do you think the bird is going to go back to the book and like, you know, and what's really great about our mix of content is we have books, games, activities, recipes, coloring sheets, all these different things. So it mimics that in real life playdate that you would have had if you could be together, right?
00;18;07;18 - 00;18;27;01
Maxeme Tuchman
Because that's exactly what would happen. You started reading a book with a child. They run into their room and they go, Oh, it's all of us together. And then you're coloring. And then all of a sudden they're like, Oh, wait, I want to grab this, right? Like your kids. This is happening. You know? Yes, it does. And so that's another really important piece is allowing the child to have some ownership in that relationship.
00;18;27;01 - 00;18;53;17
Lisa Thee
And that allows the grandparent to, again, stay active and stay engaged and feel like there is that emotional connection which which really does help. It is so innovative. And I love how you focus in on this category. Can you talk a little bit about some of the challenges we've all seen with video sharing platforms and safety for children and how you guys are differentiated in that space?
00;18;53;20 - 00;19;13;25
Maxeme Tuchman
So glad you asked because this is something we care a lot about. We are safe and secure. And I say that because a lot of video calling is not safe and secure for kids. Right. If you think about it, video calling was built for adults. It was built to mimic. Right. Like it was supposed to be the virtual meeting room.
00;19;13;29 - 00;19;35;13
Maxeme Tuchman
It was a virtual conference room. And so it was built for adults who would sit in front of a screen and and mimic the same actions of a video, like an in-person meeting, where it's just back and forth. QUESTION When you are trying to build a video call for kids having kids, that's not how they hang out with you.
00;19;35;16 - 00;20;00;13
Maxeme Tuchman
When you come over to visit a kid, you don't just sit in a meeting room and like go back and forth on questions. You you play and you move and you color and you do and you and you laugh and like there's there's things that you really have to incorporate. And the other thing is also one of the biggest issues with a lot of video calling products out there today is that they're focused on like millennials and growth.
00;20;00;16 - 00;20;20;27
Maxeme Tuchman
And so the first thing that happens when you download Houseparty is it's like, Hey, let's add everyone in your address book. Don't you want to like, talk to everyone you ever met, every random person that you met at the mall or in class or like down the street? Like, wouldn't that be so fun? And you're like, Oh my God, Like, let's not do that when it comes to kids.
00;20;20;29 - 00;20;47;10
Maxeme Tuchman
So what has been very specific about double invite, right? When you when you create, when you ask someone to be a contact on Caribu, it has to be approved on your side and their side. It's a 1 to 1 video call. So no zoombombing you no, no nefarious actors coming into your call. We're end to end encrypted. We also we really feel strongly about the fact that again, you're adding contacts.
00;20;47;11 - 00;21;15;00
Maxeme Tuchman
I'm like when you want to versus again like we add all of your address book to to the app And I think the other thing is also thinking about the content, right? Like that's another way that we keep kids safe and secure is making sure that we're always vetting the content, making sure that it's represented, making sure that it's relevant, and meeting kids where they are to give them the safety and security around social issues like COVID.
00;21;15;03 - 00;21;34;18
Maxeme Tuchman
You know, we have books about wearing a mask and social distancing right in gear. We added a category. We actually had a lot of this content, but we create a category called Courageous Conversations Anti-Racism because of the murder of George Floyd, because we wanted kids to have that safety and security of content that they can have those conversations with their family.
00;21;34;21 - 00;22;00;27
Maxeme Tuchman
We have a pride category, which actually does extremely well outside of pride, but we also have a social emotional learning category. We for the holidays, we celebrate Christmas, Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, and would love to incorporate more. We have ten different languages on the platform, specifically again, to give kids that comfort of of content that they feel either represents them or pushes them to learn more about others.
00;22;01;00 - 00;22;25;12
Lisa Thee
I love the diversity focus that you have inherently from coming from a diverse background. You built this with the global audience in mind. Can you talk a little bit about where the name Karibu came from? Because I think it's a really interesting reflection of the product you built.
00;22;25;12 - 00;22;52;00
Maxeme Tuchman
Yeah. So, you know, when you if you ever go into the kids section of the App Store, all the apps are animals, right? All the icons are animals. And animals are just a great thing for kids. Animals don't have gender, animals don't have raised animals are friendly most of the time. Animals are cute. Animals may make kids feel like, Oh, I love my animal, like there's a connection there. So we always kind of knew we wanted an animal. Then we said, Well, we're connecting people who are far apart.
00;22;52;00 - 00;23;10;27
Maxeme Tuchman
So we should look at migratory animals. We happened to realize that the Canadian reindeer, the Caribbean, is a migratory animal, and it had just as a cute little name and then obviously when you're building a tech company, you need the Twitter handle and you want the dot com. So we spelled it in Spanish. So it is actually properly spelled in Spanish.
00;23;10;27 - 00;23;28;09
Maxeme Tuchman
There is no O in the spelling of Spanish. We get that feedback a lot. People are like, You're an education company, you spell it right. And I'm like, You should spell it in Spanish. And then it would be correct. The interesting thing is, though, and also like, it's just like, sounds so cute and it's like a cute little animal.
00;23;28;09 - 00;23;49;06
Maxeme Tuchman
And then we found out that Caribu with a K means welcome in Swahili. So if you ever. Yeah. So if you're ever in a place where they speak Swahili, you'll actually hear caribou, caribou all the time. But that's how people like you. And then we found out from one of our users because again, we have families in over 200 plus countries and territories. We found out that Karibu in Malay means go to your mother. Are. So yeah, it was meant to be.
00;23;49;08 - 00;24;17;24
Lisa Thee
So Max you spoke about being listed in the App Store and I think you had some pretty exciting news this month from Apple Do you mind telling us about it made this whole thing for our listeners that aren't seeing the visuals, Can you describe to us what what you were demonstrating?
00;24;17;26 - 00;24;45;22
Maxeme Tuchman
So in my hands is the is actually Apple's most exclusive product. They only made 15 of these there are 15 of them around the world. We we were one we were named one of Apple's 15 top apps of 2020 and we we got it because we were the best app for connecting families in 2020 and they have themes each year.
00;24;45;23 - 00;25;10;11
Maxeme Tuchman
Last year was like storytelling. This year is helpfulness and we won the award for helpfulness in connecting families and it was a pretty big honor because know there's millions of apps. We have stores and a lot of people were out there helping this year. And it's it's truly a team achievement. You know, we tripled the team this year and I could not have done it without them. Right. I mean, this literally is a team award for the incredible team that that got us here and helped out families this year.
00;25;10;11 - 00;25;30;16
Lisa Thee
So speaking of generating jobs, I believe Apple recognized you earlier in the year in that category for contributing to the developer ecosystem. Can you tell me a little bit more about that?
00;25;30;16 - 00;25;55;12
Maxeme Tuchman
Oh, you mean when Tim Cook tweeted about Karibu? Yeah, that was fun too. So it's been a very difficult year for everybody. And I think one of the hardest parts was just how many companies didn't survive during the shelter in place. And that was that was really tough for us. We were very fortunate that we were growing, right. I mean, we needed to hire more people. I mean, we tmx the company overnight in March.
00;25;55;15 - 00;26;26;06
Maxeme Tuchman
But let's be clear what it's ten look like. It's not a huge army of people making the magic happen, is it? There were four of us, literally four of us working at Karibu. And then on Saturday, March 14, the company was ten x bigger, and 24 hours later. And what I learned as a CEO of a tech startup, first of all, I learned when your CTO tells you all the time that like, don't worry, if we ever like blow up on like Shark Tank, like, we'll be fine, we're going to scale.
00;26;26;06 - 00;26;46;02
Maxeme Tuchman
And I was like, okay, okay, okay. And then it was true. He built a product that scaled beautifully. The thing you learn is when you connect the company, you are 100 x the issues that you have to solve, right? I mean, you just have ten X more users that are making calls and reading books and drawing on activities and and using common sense.
00;26;46;02 - 00;27;08;23
Maxeme Tuchman
We went from, I think, like a $200 Twilio build to like a $20,000 Twilio build like almost overnight. And so the first person we hire was like a customer support person to make sure that we were talking to our customers and supporting them and everything. And we were getting so many requests for partnerships, like every content person on the planet wanted to work with us because they were like, Well, how else are we going to get our content out there?
00;27;09;01 - 00;27;25;12
Maxeme Tuchman
So that's how we got Sesame Street and DC Comics and Cartoon Network. And so we had to hire a head of partnerships with so many inbound partnership requests. And then and then again, you know, when you have four people on your team, you have 1.5 engineers. So we had to hire more engineers. We ended up hiring more marketing support.
00;27;25;12 - 00;27;44;16
Maxeme Tuchman
I mean, it was just it was insane. So we went for a team of 4 to 12 and just a couple of months and, you know, again, here was the app economy, right? The developer economy really growing at a very difficult time. And the fact that we created jobs during the pandemic was something that Apple was really proud of.
00;27;44;16 - 00;28;06;16
Maxeme Tuchman
And also we hired very quickly but were very, very conscious of making sure that our team continued to be diverse. I think that's the biggest mistake some startups make, is they don't hire diverse teams, but their customer base is diverse and that's you're not going to win like that. And our team is 67% people of color and 50% women.
00;28;06;18 - 00;28;28;25
Lisa Thee
So with that in mind, Max, I believe that you guys got recognized for creating many downstream jobs as well, not directly for caribou, but in the ecosystem beyond that. Is that is that accurate?
00;28;28;25 - 00;28;51;24
Maxeme Tuchman
I mean, we have a lot of content providers that are now making more revenue because they're there on Caribou. We have try to think of like who else we've really been helping. But there's there's been a lot of really interesting, creative partnerships that we've been able to able to build this year and give voice and an access and awareness. Like we have a publisher. She has this amazing book. It's about grief. She has a company called Guardian Lane and it's about grief and it's just the perfect book to have on care right now for kids to be able to talk about that because it's it's a lot more prevalent this year.
00;28;51;24 - 00;29;14;03
Maxeme Tuchman
And and we have a publisher dashboard and she is just like on their every day looking at all the different countries that are reading her book and it's great for her in her business and the development right because now she knows wow okay like if my book is being read a ton in Greece, maybe I need to create a version in Greek.
00;29;14;06 - 00;29;41;19
Maxeme Tuchman
Right. And so the ability to kind of work with our partners like that and our content providers and then give them that that data and that feedback and those signals, those insights so that as they're building new content, it's becoming even more relevant for for families. Yeah, I love that back. So when waters rise, all boats float and you're able to lift up everyone with you or as, as I like to say with Lizzo, when I shine, you shine.
00;29;41;26 - 00;30;10;29
Lisa Thee
So I like that. So what is your been your biggest failure so far and how did you navigate through it?
00;30;10;29 - 00;30;32;01
Maxeme Tuchman
I've had so many failure in general or at Caribu, I mean, or just last week or today. There's so many tell me one that other people might relate to, to give me something that people are going to go, Oh yeah, I totally did that. And I was super ashamed of that. And I thought I was the only person on the planet that has ever faced this kind of thing because I'm uniquely qualified to blow it and shine the light for all of us, that we all blow it all the time. And it's how you get back up, right? Oh, yes. I'll actually give you a personal one.
00;30;32;01 - 00;31;09;05
Maxeme Tuchman
Like it's a it's a personal failure that I again, it's it's really unfortunate that it took me so long to recover from it. And and I tell this story often because I feel like it's it's a shared experience and I want to share my story. So, again, like you said, it helps people. But when I was in college, I, I had a really terrible stranger, the professor who pretty much said the only reason I got into college was because I checked Latina off on my application.
00;31;09;08 - 00;31;37;24
Maxeme Tuchman
And that's so tone deaf. That was not fun, especially when you're 20 and and you're impressionable and and even as confident and as, like, fierce as I am, like, you know, you're still trying to figure out the world. And when someone in authority says that to you, you think, oh, maybe there's some truth to this. Like, maybe, maybe he knows more than I do, or maybe you don't have anyone telling you different.
00;31;37;27 - 00;31;57;06
Maxeme Tuchman
Right? And I think we all have that imposter syndrome character sitting on our shoulder that's ready to pop up at any given time to say, you know, they're on to something. You thought you fooled everybody, but they're on to something. I think that's a very universal human experience. Yeah. And and that stuck with me for way longer than it should have.
00;31;57;06 - 00;32;24;13
Maxeme Tuchman
And it's kind of one of my biggest personal failures is that I didn't and that I lost so much time and again. Like, you know, it's it's there's nothing that I mean, there's nothing I could have done about it. I don't know that I could have I think I had to wrestle with it. And I think I had to to to have that that kind of period of my life where I, I kind of did second guess like, oh, am I here because of this or did I get this because of this?
00;32;24;13 - 00;32;59;28
Maxeme Tuchman
And like, because it only made me stronger later, I think mean. It's unfortunate and it was painful to go through. But the thing that got me out of it is interesting. The reason I kind of look back on that as like, Wow, that was unfortunate. But there is kind of a nice side to the story is I was applying business school and when I was doing a tour of the business schools, I obviously went to all the Latina know like, you know, welcome parties and there was a like a welcome from the Latino Association and Harvard Business School.
00;32;59;28 - 00;33;24;21
Maxeme Tuchman
And there was a guy who was speaking on a panel, right. We were there to learn, but also to like network. And so he's speaking on this panel and he is amazing, amazing man. Gary Cooper, while still a mentor of mine today. And he says that he's he's Mexican-American and that when he was at HBS, you know, there was a student that came up to him and said, you only got in here because you're Mexican-American.
00;33;24;24 - 00;33;42;00
Maxeme Tuchman
And he had the same like you could see in his face that he had the same kind of times that I had. It's hard to talk about, right? It's hard to even say that out loud. It's just so offensive and so horrible and it's so embarrassing that you like like, believed it. And so he says this this part.
00;33;42;00 - 00;34;02;07
Maxeme Tuchman
And he goes, you know, I went into one of my professors and I was pretty down and I went to this professor and I was like, man, this like classmate thinks I got in here because I'm Mexican-American. That's like the only thing that qualify me. And the professor said to him, Okay, so maybe you did getting your Mexican-American, but you're not going to get out because you're Mexican-American.
00;34;02;10 - 00;34;27;05
Maxeme Tuchman
And I was like, What? Holy crap, you're right. What, like this whole time? Yes. If someone had just said that to me, like 20 minutes after this stupid professor, then like, I want to save someone's time. But, like, you're so right. Like, who cares, right? Like, like if I'm not qualified, if I'm not smart enough, if I'm not an incredible, like, creative and qualified person, like, you're right.
00;34;27;05 - 00;34;52;21
Maxeme Tuchman
I'm not going to make it out by myself or like, with support or like, you like it just I was like, Oh, and like my entire like everything just shifted. And and so I tell this story often because I hope it helps someone else. Like, I just hope that very story and my story, like, let someone else kind of also see like, yeah, I don't care if people have said this to me, it's not true, and here's why it's not true.
00;34;52;21 - 00;35;16;26
Lisa Thee
Here is like literally, like factual reasons why it's true. So yeah, Max, I can relate 100%. Being a woman with an engineering degree and coming up with the ranks in the technology companies, I'm sure more than once there was somebody that thought I checked a box to get in the room, but I never, ever had to worry about that too much because eventually your results speak for themselves and clearly you've hit that bar.
00;35;16;29 - 00;35;58;16
Lisa Thee
So with that in mind, do you mind sharing with us what did she met you that you've done that has made you the most proud to date?
00;35;58;16 - 00;36;26;12
Maxeme Tuchman
This is going to sound it's going to sound weird, but let me explain it. Getting into Harvard was actually, I think, my greatest achievement and why is because when you come from an immigrant family, when they've given up so much and sacrificed so much again, to give you the opportunity that they never had when your parents never went to college and you're the first one in your family to go to college and graduate from college and then even dream of going to grad school, when you get into a school like Harvard and your parents get to tell their friends and their community that their daughter is going to Harvard, like, to me, that was the greatest gift I could give my family, whether I went there or not. Right? It's just like and funny story. I actually didn't apply to some schools because, like, can you imagine my Cuban father saying, well, like when you like, know, So I actually didn't like this so stupid.
00;36;26;12 - 00;36;41;17
Maxeme Tuchman
I really didn't apply to Google because I was like, there's no and he's not going to be super brat. Like, he's he's going to tell his little Cuban friend that the little bit that his daughter goes to for Google, whatever, however you pronounce it, everyone's going be like, what, No pride there, right? So like, yeah, super easy to pronounce.
00;36;41;17 - 00;37;08;18
Maxeme Tuchman
Harvard, super. And let me just tell you something. In the in the community that speaks Spanish. So Latinx community, going to Yale is not a great place to go because in in like, like Spanglish, it sounds like your child is in jail. Like, Oh, you got that in Yale and you're like, in jail and you're like, Wait, did you say he's in jail?
00;37;08;20 - 00;37;34;00
Maxeme Tuchman
I'm so sorry. Like, no, no. A Yale and Yale is like, so again. Yeah. Then go to Yale, because, I mean, you just prevented so many misunderstandings by choosing the path you did. So I think you should be proud of that to achieve that. So with that in mind, what are some emerging trends you're seeing in your field that you think we should all be paying more attention to?
00;37;34;02 - 00;38;00;23
Lisa Thee
You know, something near and dear to both of our hearts is data security know just just what's happening with data. Data is the new oil. I actually I've heard that people have evolved. That point of view to data can be the new kryptonite, but not handled properly. Oh, yes. Yeah. Yep. Especially children's data, right, Max? I mean, not only children's data, but then, right?
00;38;00;23 - 00;38;36;15
Lisa Thee
I mean, you're getting them right. Like children's data lasts for a while. Like, I mean, how thankful are you and I that Facebook didn't exist? Like when we were like, the amount of the amount of content that kids have online, that was not their choice to put it. They're chanting oversharing, all those parenthood photos.
00;38;36;15 - 00;39;05;01
Maxeme Tuchman
Yes, I, I often think what how sad it is for young people today that they don't get to experiment in the same ways in a lower risk environment of who they are and what they're passionate about. And given that chance to evolve and grow without an audience, without it living in perpetuity, because none of us got here without stumbles and fumbles and, you know, it's much easier to live that down when somebody is not replaying it over and over and over again on the Internet. Search for it years later. Right. And stupid things that kids say sometimes, like without understanding who it affects or how it affects that lives with you forever.
00;39;05;01 - 00;39;26;21
Maxeme Tuchman
And I think the other thing that's scary is also just how many eyes are on kids, right? How how much feedback kids are taking in from from people who don't have their best interests at heart. And I think about this a lot, especially in the work that I do, protecting kids. And and that's why I love what I get to do.
00;39;26;21 - 00;39;54;06
Maxeme Tuchman
Right. It's it's the great stuff that has to do with kids interacting with technology. But but it's yeah, it's a fine line, right? It's and also the pressure to grow a company that relies on insane growth and sharing and virality and all of the things that sometimes are counterintuitive to protecting kids. So that's something I think about a lot.
00;39;54;09 - 00;40;20;18
Lisa Thee
Yeah, I think you have done something really innovative in the market by starting with the needs of your customer first, not the demands of Silicon Valley, and that is truly designing technology with kids in mind from the start, not trying to retrofit it after the fact. Right. Yeah. And that's that's going to be a big problem, I think, with a lot of existing tech companies who realize that kids are using their is what is it, season five of Silicon Valley on HBO, Right?
00;40;20;18 - 00;40;49;29
Maxeme Tuchman
It's like a hot dog. No hot dog. There's so many. Yeah. I mean, that show is if you are a founder listening to this, like just watch that show. You know what this next five years of your life will look like. But yeah, yeah. I love the focus group scene where it's a bunch of young children in the audience and then like 150 year old dude, it was like the perfect episode for showcasing what happens when you don't enforce terms of service.
00;40;50;01 - 00;41;15;05
Lisa Thee
Everything was like spot on. Like, it's so scary to watch sometimes. I'm like, Oh my God, that's me. It's like, Yeah, they were they were very savvy with the way that they presented that. So with that, Max, where can people find you and keep tabs on what you're working on and help support your work? Yes. So since this is an audio podcast, let's spell the name CAIR iView is Karibu.
00;41;15;07 - 00;41;38;17
Maxeme Tuchman
Yes. So since this is an audio podcast, let's spell the name KARIBU is Karibu. Karibu dot Com is where you can find us. We do have a freemium model, so please download the app or find us on the web app, which is app Doc. Here dot com. Sign up and try us out. Make your first magical Karibu call and then trust me, you you will want to use this all the time with your kids and grandkids or nieces, nephews, God, God, kids.
00;41;38;17 - 00;42;01;24
Maxeme Tuchman
We have a lot of different relationships happening and feel free to find me on LinkedIn or Twitter. That's usually where I'm talking about running a startup. So that's helpful. Yeah, and I must admit I follow you and you are never at a loss for interesting content and innovative ways of looking at it as a female founder, as a diverse person in the world.
00;42;01;24 - 00;42;20;29
Lisa Thee
I think you are exactly the change that I want to see because you made it on all of your credentials. You've brought innovation to the world and increased access to so many that we can all have a great foundation of education so that we can all rise with the with the waters rising. So thank you so much for your time today, Max.
00;42;20;29 - 00;42;38;17
Lisa Thee
It's always a pleasure. Ditto. Thanks for having me. Hey, everyone. Thanks for listening to the Navigating Forward podcast. We'd love to hear from you at a crossroads of uncertainty and opportunity. How do you navigate forward? We'll see you next time.